WAC Beta v0.1 - Downloads, comments, suggestions

[Krigulv]

I don't know whether that's intended but during character creation (new game) two new races are available: Wood Witches and Bretons (with funny cap and one blind eye).

not really intended, actually.

I'm not able to create a new race that have dialogue, but that is not playable. Every time I tried, it made the npc mute in game without greeting, only solution to keep the speech is by making them playable. No idea what cause this. I tried to search a lot for an answer to this, no clue.

Breton are Poisoners. Poisoners are not supposed to be playable but somewhat friendly NPC that can make poisons for you, or sell you some already made ones (more expensive) Wood Witches, could be playable, but that mean editing many quest to have it work as a normal PC. The intention was to tell the player not to use those races at all for their character, or at least change the race right befor exit the tunnel only, so the emperor will have had his words with you about birthsign and such (unless you useQuickChar or something like that to skip the into)

normally I made them Wood Witches) as an enemy that will roam/live in the forest, magic users that don't like to be disturbed Ah damn I didn't put them in any list yet too!!

Hm.. maybe look into what makes the Dremora different from the playable races. I know they have at least some dialogue late into the main quest, but I'm not sure if that's what you mean.

[Sethsryt]

Waalx, thank you for allowing me to download the alpha.
It looks great already, I mean, if this is an Alpha I can't wait to see the final.
Sorry that it took some time to reply and post a bug report.
It's just so grand, I couldn't stop playing. And I haven't even visited the goblin camps.

But what you did to the mythic dawn hoods, can't you make two separated (The vanilla and yours) and not one as replacer for the other. I liked the mythic dawn with some reddish armor. So I do hope the old version will come back. But the new can certainly stay for the higher ranks of the mythic dawn.

The bandit scarves clipped with my character's nose, which was sad for I do really like it. So could you please make the scarve a little bit wider. More like the hoods with the scarve included.
Picture of scarve and clipping:



I liked all the hangings, crucified and such. Really gives a nice gloomy feel. Though maybe it's better to use custom textures on the fresh hangings/punished. That would make it easier to alter it to work with body mods (I know you don't like them very much, but I do, and the recent from roberts are quite realistic. >.<And>.<

Hmm, I can't think of any more yet. Need to test it some more.
I hope my report was a bit useful,

Good luck with the mod,
It really improves the game.
Though, please keep armors like glass and such exotic things in leveled lists.
Maybe not on bandits, but it would be bad if it wasn't available anymore.

Though, Daedric armor shouldn't be readily available in Tamriel. Better to keep it limited to Oblivion realms and such.
A Marauder boss would be able to kill a Dremora and take one or two pieces of Daedric. Yet a weak Bandit shouldn't wear such stuff.

I wonder, is it hard to add stuff to a leveled list?

[trollf]

few more from me:

- xivilai katana and xivilai lesser magma blade have no unique icons but those of standard deadric longsword
- many bandit armors (like brass, white fur, strapped fur, etc.) have ground models of standard iron cuirass
- red and black scarves can be equipped but aren't visible with bandit black hood equipped (with other helmets they are visible, so I presume the problem is with those bandit black hoods)
- "Steel plate Thief Greaves Right" - one word starts with small letter here, just a very minor inconsistency with other names ;]

[Sethsryt]

Quote on the black and red scarves not being visible.
It seems as if the Scarves occupy the necklace slot, so with some of the cuirasses it won't show. Maybe this can be changed?

few more from me:

- xivilai katana and xivilai lesser magma blade have no unique icons but those of standard deadric longsword
- many bandit armors (like brass, white fur, strapped fur, etc.) have ground models of standard iron cuirass
- red and black scarves can be equipped but aren't visible with bandit black hood equipped (with other helmets they are visible, so I presume the problem is with those bandit black hoods)
- "Steel plate Thief Greaves Right" - one word starts with small letter here, just a very minor inconsistency with other names ;]

[dewshine]

Ok, I still haven't located the crashing problem outside anvil, other then to note that with WAC deactivated I still crash there. I'm going to wait 3 days and go back and see if that makes a difference.

I too noticed that the hanged have minor conflicts with body mods, but I think if I do some texture switching I can correct that (I just need to pull the foot texture back out of the bsa and rename it then point the standard foot mesh to it). Cosmetic mostly, no big deal.

I'm finding dead Armless everywhere. Well I think the bandits from Vilverin were chasing them down and killing them because the only bandit I found outside there was the archer and she was near the the little pier on the other side of the ruins from the camp. Another bandit was in the water, about 10 steps from the sewer. Normally I find 3 there (with Frans at least) and I haven't found the third one.

Looking in the barrel next to the sewer I found only heavy armor. No light armor at all. Although there was fur, but it said 'heavy'. And I can't find the ring in the boat. Might it have fallen? I didn't TCL to check.

Somehow I've ended up with Bronze armor and Silver armor for sale at Best Defense. This might be part of something else though... I don't tend to buy my armor, as I prefer to kill others to get it.

I spotted a 'sun crab' very pretty. almost jewel like. It was passive unlike the mud crabs. But was it meant to be - glittery?

[Mormacil]

The ring is in a box between the rubble wood near the boat.

[dewshine]

The ring is in a box between the rubble wood near the boat.

Ah. thank you much.

[amievil85]

Alex, I'm not in front of my home comp, but I have about 20-something mods installed, not OOO or MMM but mostly little stuff. There haven't been Any compatibility problems yet but, as I said before there's something a little hinky with the animals AI. Other than that and that fact that I keep getting lost in that big open plain thing, everything looks good!

[DarkWind]

The bronze and silver armor are more than likely from the forgotten shields mod.

[Krigulv]

Really weird bug, which i'm not totally sure if WAC is related.
Whenever I watch/bet on Arena matches, the blue guy never has any weapons or shield. The only thing he has equipped is his raiment and a helmet. I wouldn't think there was any changes to the arena in the WAC esps, but this has only ever happened for me after installing those. I'll check without WAC and see if it makes any difference.

Update: Okay, doesn't seem to be WAC-related after all. On my lower level character, I tried with all WAC esps and the esm unchecked, and the blue guy had his weapons. Then I tried on that same character with all the WAC stuff checked, and the blue guy still had weapons. Then I tried on my higher-level character (both with and without WAC stuff loaded), and the blue guy had no weapons. So it seems it's not related to the WAC stuff.

Though something I find to be a bit of a nuisance IS related to WAC The creatures that run from you (like the mice in the Arena red room, the deer in the fields, etc) are somehow enemies and prevent you from sleeping while they are near (You cannot sleep while enemies are nearby). Is this something that can be fixed without having to actually hunt down the little critters just to get some shut-eye?

[dewshine]

The bronze and silver armor are more than likely from the forgotten shields mod.

Right, . The name of the heavy armor just threw me was all. It's good.

The Bandit Fur chest piece is saying "Heavy Armor" (I got one off the Bandit leader, very cool armor, but shouldn't it be light armor?)

The Wide Boots, (weight of 10, AC of 6) have a value of 0. I assume that is because it's the base item that the magic 7 league boots are based on. They are nice boots, but it seems strange that they are worth nothing.

The Scarves. Face issues with clipping might be solved by running them through the Conformulator (I think that's what it's called) just like the wigs. This would make them fit nearly any face. My test character is a Kajiit and can't wear them. Then again she can't wear circlets either.

Removing Alive Waters seemed to help with my water based crashes, so I think there's a conflict there with 'too many spawns' for my machine to handle with both WAC and Alive Waters. Pity.

I killed an azure crab, just for kicks, and it fell into the ground when it died. It might be a collusion box issue. I was able to find it because of the arrow sticking up out of the ground.

Frans adventures killed most of the bandits in Vilverin. Then the DB dude showed up to speak with my character and they attacked him -- he cut them down. Just thought it was funny...

Oh the green robe-- I much perfer Slof's texture. Might I suggest changing your mesh to use it? Or do you think it's too bright?

[Haruko]

, I had an amulate on (it's a cheat, just to warn you) 120% reflect damage and magic... a bandit killed me! O.o I'm not even sure how it happened, all I know is suddenly I was dead . Still having that sound issue, going to test out your quiet feet and see if it does anything. All other things I'm not having an issue with, just a few small things like icons for equipment, I do notice that if I get a bandit down to low health, it tends to run away, usually in a circle though.

Edit: there seems to be no female textures for your bandit armors, with some of them it's kinda rational to not have a different one because they are so bulky it could just be that you can't make out detail, but try equipping a femail with the "Bandit Belt" iirc. Small thing, just thought I'd mention it.

[Tlo1048]

I had a few problems with my first test.
The sensitivity of the animals I encountered (Armless (all colors), Pheasants, Elk) was a bit off. I couldn't get within 30 feet of most of the creatures without them running off. I was trying to take screenshots of as many creatures I could to make some in-game catalogs.
Also, with the bandits. They seem a bit...heavily armed. I mean, dont get me wrong, I love the idea and I love all the new armors, but it all seems a bit weighted. Just simple things like the winged helmet on a bandit, but he has an Iron bow. It just a bit unbalanced. Maybe more patchworks, and padded cloths.

I LOVE the mod so far. Its what Oblivion should have been the first time around. You've made it much, much more enjoyable. Time to go see the rest of these creatures!

PS I'm having problems with all the armless bodies everywhere. I think either the creatures are set to kill them, or the bandits are just killing them all.
PPS The Golden Elk is BEAUTIFUL. Very, very nice model Waalx.

[DarkWind]

OK, I'm fixed and I've been playing for a while. I stopped to report so I don't forget

- When you equip bandit sleeveless armors the tattoos show on your arms - which probably is unavoidable, but still strange.

- The lesser magma and xivilai katanas at the start have completely different weights even though they're the same size, and they don't have unique icons.

- all bandit armor I've found use the vanilla iron armor icons and _gnd models.

- I met what appeared to be a fox (It's red with a white-tipped tail) but it was called a maned wolf. They are aggressive but run away after a few hits from what I can see.

[Krigulv]

Real-life maned wolves are colored a bit like foxes. Their legs are much longer in life than in WAC though.

[Kalendra Star]

Hello! (We need hello wave emoticon.)

I downloaded it yesterday and am installing it now. I've been watching this mod from the start, and it looks fantastic!

Does anyone know the compatibility with mods like Unique Landscapes and Better Cities? If not, I'll gladly test them!

(We also need a thinking or plotting emote.)

[Haruko]

Hello! (We need hello wave emoticon.)

I downloaded it yesterday and am installing it now. I've been watching this mod from the start, and it looks fantastic!

Does anyone know the compatibility with mods like Unique Landscapes and Better Cities? If not, I'll gladly test them!

(We also need a thinking or plotting emote.)

The UL mods don't seem to be an issue, atleast not for me, though slower computers might suffer some severe fps problems. I'm still having that sound issue, the quiet feet patch didn't fix it, and frankly I'm at a loss as to what the cause is.

[DarkWind]

I also had the same problem as someone earlier. I met a stunted red bull scamp outside sardavar leed and his head was a lighter texture than his body.

[Krigulv]

I also had the same problem as someone earlier. I met a stunted red bull scamp outside sardavar leed and his head was a lighter texture than his body.

Make sure to download the latest version. The glowmaps for the heads weren't included in the first version, so Waalx added them in another zip in the first post.

[Waalx]

But what you did to the mythic dawn hoods, can't you make two separated (The vanilla and yours) and not one as replacer for the other. I liked the mythic dawn with some reddish armor. So I do hope the old version will come back. But the new can certainly stay for the higher ranks of the mythic dawn.

I can always do that. I was trying to have them different from mages in fact.

The bandit scarves clipped with my character's nose, which was sad for I do really like it. So could you please make the scarve a little bit wider. More like the hoods with the scarve included.
Picture of scarve and clipping:

This is to answers about the Bandit scarves.

They are amulet for a reason, ie. to be able to have an open helmet with scarf, or just the open helmet, but without the need of 3 different models, egm files, world models for each helm versions. Making the scarves work as amulet was the best I could do to minimize that.
I tried to conformulate the scarves, but it doesn't seem to work, maybe because it's not on the head? I also did them as amulet so you can wear one and still have hair on your head! As thus, I made some item hide the scarves if they already cover the face (like a full face helm). They are meant for my bandits, and all bandits gears should either show them, or not depending on if they should or not. Helms are usually the thing that can hide the amulet slot. As you can see with the hair, or the helm, it's always tricky to decide what to do if you want to add something that goes on the head models. that's the best I found.

khajiit and argonian, the scarf won't work. It would need another model to fit their bigger snout.

Hm.. maybe look into what makes the Dremora different from the playable races. I know they have at least some dialogue late into the main quest, but I'm not sure if that's what you mean.

I tried that.. no more luck. Wood witches are based on a copy of Dremora actually. I wanted them to have the same voice, it didn't work. New races are tricky at best.

add that to the To-Do list.

I liked all the hangings, crucified and such. Really gives a nice gloomy feel. Though maybe it's better to use custom textures on the fresh hangings/punished. That would make it easier to alter it to work with body mods (I know you don't like them very much, but I do, and the recent from roberts are quite realistic. >.<And>.<

ah my favorite thing, the bodies mods... I was waiting for that one..hehe

For the gibbets, hanging corpses, they are using the vanilla body texture of each races. making them use a custom texture would need me to edit each one of them (around 60 objects), and redirect them to a folder that would hold all the skin textures in a different place than now. Lets say I don't feel like re-editing all the corpses? that's not an understatement, each body have around 8 textures or more that would need to be redirected. Would be like...hmm 15 mb more for that.

I said it previously that I don't like those body mods, it's not for no reason. Worst about that is that you can no more do something complicated that use skin, and call it done for everyone. Not one of those mod follow the same texture convention, although it would have been easy to do so. It try to reinvent the wheel, but make it square shaped. Just, great!
Great that, to have it work, every item that show skin need to be remade. From my opinion, there wasn't a lot of thinking in all that. It's the worst thing that was done for Oblivion in my opinion. It was made as if to cause problem with everything, for everything.
Yeah sure you could say some people have ported all the clothing and stuff. But the thing is, this should not have been needed, at all.

If all you do is make one piece or armor. It's easy for somebody to come along and adjust it to fit those body mods, maybe. If you do a couple hundreds new items that would need to be ported, not very interesting for anyone to do. Least is me, who did it once already! take the bandits armors, or the Gladiators armors I have. They show skin, some a lot. All will need to be remade to fit those Poser bodies? What a crap! But truly, WHAT A CRAP! For a guy who develop content like me, this is the worst thing in all of it.

The only rational for me was to make it all on vanilla. The rest it's not going to be my job to adjust it to other mods that are not official, or that some people use but others use that one instead because of the C-cup, and that I'm not even using myself for various reasons.

sorry about that. you touched me deep, man! I so hate those mods.

Cause. It's not only, the gibbets corpses, but also anything else that I made or will do, that have skin on it. That so much that I don't even know how much it .

I can't promise anything here. And sorry for my rambling

I hope my report was a bit useful,

Every report is useful to me... !

Though, please keep armors like glass and such exotic things in leveled lists.
Maybe not on bandits, but it would be bad if it wasn't available anymore.

They won't appear in bandit lists, or should I say ON bandits. They will appear as loot in places, and with all, you'll get a chance to find some in special place, special loot that I will hand-place around that you can find even at level 1. rare but can happen. If I was following my mind on this I would unlock all lvl list of armors to be available at all time. I can understand the fact you get better gears in a video game where you can only find it, but if it's a free-roaming world like Oblivion, I think having armor and weapons appear by magic in the world because you get better is silly.

A solution I was thinking about this was that the armors could be scripted to become an encumbrance if you are too weak for them. You would still be able to use them, but it would weight a lot more on you or something like that. Like ok you're at level 1 and want to wear an ebony cuirass. You can, but your encumbrance would be almost full in that case. that would permit it without making it too easy. You would then start as a 'real life' knight, who with an armor on, can't carry much else. When you get better, you kind of adapt to wearing an armor and it leave you more room to act, until it become just a normal item. just an idea though...

Though, Daedric armor shouldn't be readily available in Tamriel. Better to keep it limited to Oblivion realms and such.
A Marauder boss would be able to kill a Dremora and take one or two pieces of Daedric. Yet a weak Bandit shouldn't wear such stuff.

Daedric will only be found in Oblivion. Or by conjuration. (you'll be able to bring back Daedric stuff from Oblivion yourself though).

I wonder, is it hard to add stuff to a leveled list?

Nope. Its just a list. the beauty of it is that you can change what's in them at will.

I could use all the new spawns of WAC.esp that spawn a lvl list like WACLL1OblivionLowLife on oblivion planes, and replace the content with something else.

- xivilai katana and xivilai lesser magma blade have no unique icons but those of standard deadric longsword
- many bandit armors (like brass, white fur, strapped fur, etc.) have ground models of standard iron cuirass
- red and black scarves can be equipped but aren't visible with bandit black hood equipped (with other helmets they are visible, so I presume the problem is with those bandit black hoods)
- "Steel plate Thief Greaves Right" - one word starts with small letter here, just a very minor inconsistency with other names ;]

- I still need to finish those, only one have fine so far. Indeed the icons are not done either! (man do I have work to do!)
- bandits armors are in the To-DO list, and are only half made. I didn't create the world models yet. Still not sure how i'm going to make them, like if I add some belt stuff too or not ( to world model). Icons to do here as well.
- refer to what I say up in this post on bandit scarves.
- hehe another of those long names. Should I just rename that like I did for the Iron and Bronze helms? maybe I should.

I'm finding dead Armless everywhere. Well I think the bandits from Vilverin were chasing them down and killing them because the only bandit I found outside there was the archer and she was near the the little pier on the other side of the ruins from the camp. Another bandit was in the water, about 10 steps from the sewer. Normally I find 3 there (with Frans at least) and I haven't found the third one.

Looking in the barrel next to the sewer I found only heavy armor. No light armor at all. Although there was fur, but it said 'heavy'. And I can't find the ring in the boat. Might it have fallen? I didn't TCL to check.

I spotted a 'sun crab' very pretty. almost jewel like. It was passive unlike the mud crabs. But was it meant to be - glittery?

I would like a way for the armless to be left in peace or flee other creatures. In fact I would like a script that make the prey flee not only from you, but from any other evil AI that attack them. I find it weird that some beast won't flee a predator at all, even when it attack, but will flee the player on sight.

that would be better and more realistic, and would solve the armless being chased by everyone maybe.

I tried to have the armless not be attacked by beasts and evil NPC by giving them all factions at once, but they stillf got attacked, or would attack their own. always something that go wrong.

For the armors, I checked and yes although they are fur I left them on heavy armor setting. that goes in the To-Do list.

a couple of crabs the Sun, Black, and Azur ones I think, are using envmap2 reflection, (or the glass shader if you prefer). I think they look nice this way, and it make a difference with the other colors that are not shinny like the green, blue, and white? not sure anymore..

[quote="amivil85']Alex, I'm not in front of my home comp, but I have about 20-something mods installed, not OOO or MMM but mostly little stuff. There haven't been Any compatibility problems yet but, as I said before there's something a little hinky with the animals AI. Other than that and that fact that I keep getting lost in that big open plain thing, everything looks good![/quote]

no problem on compatibility is nice! as I said, the AI could do with more, I know. Hopefully a better mind than mine can do it. On that, I'm on my limit already.

Though something I find to be a bit of a nuisance IS related to WAC Razz The creatures that run from you (like the mice in the Arena red room, the deer in the fields, etc) are somehow enemies and prevent you from sleeping while they are near (You cannot sleep while enemies are nearby). Is this something that can be fixed without having to actually hunt down the little critters just to get some shut-eye?

Ok I remember that bug I had it too while testing. I think I'm going to need to create a special types of mouses just for the city. The fact they are prey seems to trigger the "You cannot sleep while enemies are nearby".

The Bandit Fur chest piece is saying "Heavy Armor" (I got one off the Bandit leader, very cool armor, but shouldn't it be light armor?)

answer is up here!

The Wide Boots, (weight of 10, AC of 6) have a value of 0. I assume that is because it's the base item that the magic 7 league boots are based on. They are nice boots, but it seems strange that they are worth nothing.

yes that's because of the 7 Leagues Boots, you,re right. It's now fixed.

The Scarves. Face issues with clipping might be solved by running them through the Conformulator (I think that's what it's called) just like the wigs. This would make them fit nearly any face. My test character is a Kajiit and can't wear them. Then again she can't wear circlets either.

answered up here

Removing Alive Waters seemed to help with my water based crashes, so I think there's a conflict there with 'too many spawns' for my machine to handle with both WAC and Alive Waters. Pity.

Alive Water is very intensive on spawn points. Too much for the amount of water there is on the map I think. That mod made my game crawl every times I tried it. It look beautiful when you're underwater though. AW has the same number of spawn point I have in the whole of WAC I think, and just for a small part of the world as the water is rare in Cyrodiil. Top that with the fishes that have a complex script running on each one to have them move around... it's not very friendly on performance.
Sharks spawn are not that numerous. Only a few are around, but I did use the AW script to make them move underwater (for now), so maybe it could be this? too much scripting going on.

I killed an azure crab, just for kicks, and it fell into the ground when it died. It might be a collusion box issue. I was able to find it because of the arrow sticking up out of the ground.

I think it's because the crabs are very small. Sometimes they walk around in the sand and they go 'through it' a bit. So it can happen that the rag doll doesn't react that well with such small things. Not to worry though, the small crabs have only crab meat in them.

Oh the green robe-- I much perfer Slof's texture. Might I suggest changing your mesh to use it? Or do you think it's too bright?

That's not possible. I'm not using outside resources in WAC, only new things I do by myself, or reworked from vanilla. I'm going to use animations and stuff like that, but anything that touch graphics and modeling I do by myself on this project.

But you can easily create an esp that will change the robe in WAC - WWW.esp to something else. Although it won't have a belt and stuff then. That would need some copy/paste in nifscope to create a new object. In the end it's a matter of taste and getting what you want

, I had an amulate on (it's a cheat, just to warn you) 120% reflect damage and magic... a bandit killed me! O.o I'm not even sure how it happened, all I know is suddenly I was dead . Still having that sound issue, going to test out your quiet feet and see if it does anything. All other things I'm not having an issue with, just a few small things like icons for equipment, I do notice that if I get a bandit down to low health, it tends to run away, usually in a circle though.

Edit: there seems to be no female textures for your bandit armors, with some of them it's kinda rational to not have a different one because they are so bulky it could just be that you can't make out detail, but try equipping a femail with the "Bandit Belt" iirc. Small thing, just thought I'd mention it.

I don't know what happenned to the bandit killing you with your amulet on. I just know that I didn't touch the bandit power or AI, just their clothes. Running away in circle that the second time I hear this..

no idea about your sound issue. that's quite weird.

The bandit females, some don't have a textures, it's made like that to limit the number of different maps. Actually, only the bandit fur cuirass use the same textures, and one type of greaves (those alike the vanilla Iron greaves). For the fur model, it's because the style of the original female cuirass of vanilla look completely off if I want to add belt stuff and daggers. Models are different from male or females though. The thief greaves are like in vanilla where they both use the same map. Other than that the females have their own texture for iron cuirass, and bronze and such.

The sensitivity of the animals I encountered (Armless (all colors), Pheasants, Elk) was a bit off. I couldn't get within 30 feet of most of the creatures without them running off. I was trying to take screenshots of as many creatures I could to make some in-game catalogs.

having the AI behave differently is out of my leagues.

To take screenshots: get closest you can to what you want to photograph in sneak mode, open the console and type 'tlc'. that will turn of the collision of the camera, and you can then go where you want, as close as you want and take the shot in any angle you want (and that is much more cool). Type 'tlc' again in the console to return to your body.

Also, with the bandits. They seem a bit...heavily armed. I mean, dont get me wrong, I love the idea and I love all the new armors, but it all seems a bit weighted. Just simple things like the winged helmet on a bandit, but he has an Iron bow. It just a bit unbalanced. Maybe more patchworks, and padded cloths.

bandits are not over yet. More to come. But they will carry iron and brass, what I can name cheap heavy armors stuff too, and some light armors as well. Marauders will use more quality stuff with only some of bandit crap thrown in.

PS I'm having problems with all the armless bodies everywhere. I think either the creatures are set to kill them, or the bandits are just killing them all.

answer is up in this post.

- When you equip bandit sleeveless armors the tattoos show on your arms - which probably is unavoidable, but still strange.

yeah I was aware of that. I can either remove the tattoos, or keep it as this.

- The lesser magma and xivilai katanas at the start have completely different weights even though they're the same size, and they don't have unique icons.
- all bandit heavy cuirasses I've found use the vanilla iron cuirass icon and _gnd model.

answered up in this post

- I met what appeared to be a fox (It's red with a white-tipped tail) but it was called a maned wolf. They are aggressive but run away after a few hits from what I can see.

Maned Wolves look like big foxes in reality.

(We need hello wave emoticon.)

added some for you convenience



all for the reports!

I'm adding everything wrong to the To-Do list.